Have you, like me, been following the Presidential Campaign in the USA? Wow! They know how to drag something out don't they? It has been fun to watch though, and seeing the candidates Obama & McCain, turning out in all corners of the country to bid for those last few votes made me realise just how important it is for politicians of what ever level, to connect with the electorate.
I know that last week, it was a fairly intense news week. Feeling was running high throughout the city in the run up to the governance referendum, and for what? A below 20% turn out!
I found myself pondering why the turn out was so bad, do the people of our city care about what happens? Are the population so pissed off at the state of local politics? I came to the conclusion that councillors and MP's alike need to engage with the population of our city!
Over the next seven months, our politicians have a chance of a new beginning, a clean slate. There is too much complacency, councillors say all to often " this is the way it's always been done", well that just won't do anymore!
The debate in this city of who will be leader and what party stands for what has got to be re-ignited. The people of Stoke on Trent need to be won over and our interest in the local political issues awakened.
What I would like to see is for us to take a leaf out of America's book. I want to see the candidates for the Leadership contest go head to head in a number of public debates at somewhere like the Kings Hall (pictured top right) in Stoke with a packed audience and the whole thing broadcast to the entire city.
We have been small time for too long now, time to think big! It's is time for our politicians to be made to face their electorate and to answer the questions put to them from us, the public.
We don't want the Council's highly paid press officer fencing the more demanding and sensitive questions. We don't want it all to be kept "low key" and to be sorted behind close doors.
We want straight answers, straight talking and above all, we want the best man/woman winning.
By the time next May come around we want each party to state who is going to be their preferred Leadership Candidate and it should be this person that faces the public and fights to win the day for their parties! We want to know what each and every party stands for and what their manifesto is, so that we can make are minds up who will do the best job of leading our city.
They should know that if they do not deliver on their promises, both leader and party will be made to pay at the first chance at the ballot box, nowhere to run and no where to hide!
I would love the chance of chairing these debates. I would make sure every question was answered by all the leadership candidates. Imagine a packed Kings Hall and on stage the Labour, Conservative, Libdem, BNP and Independents leadership candidates all trying to win the day for their party and for themselves.
This would surely bring the party voice back into Stoke after so long of just hearing the same old, same old from the Elected Mayor and his Portfolio Holders.
We deserve more don't we? We deserve a choice of what party and we deserve to know which leader we will get from that chosen party, don't we?
So I throw the gauntlet down to the parties in our City:
Labour - Will it be Mike, Mark or Joy and what will you do for this City? Are your group united? Will you do better than when you had the majority last time? Will you look again at the decisions that made the Labour Elected Mayor so unpopular?
Conservative - Will it be Roger or Ross, and what will you do for the people you have so badly let down in Trentham and what Tory policies can we hear about?
Libdem - Will it be Jean or Keiran and how will you make your party electable in a city that has seen so few Libdem candidates in the past, will you tell us just what do you stand for?
BNP - Will it be Alby, Mike or Steve and is your party racist? What will you do for the sizable number of British people born here but who's skin colour isn't white?
What do we have to fear from you?
Independent - Will it be Alan, Brian or Terry and just what the hell do you lot stand for? What are your policies? Why do you court all the other parties in this city? Have you got a party manifesto?
I feel so passionate about getting this PUBLIC debate on and I want your help! I promise you I would make Jeremy Paxman seem like Bambi! I want to know what questions you want answers to! I want to know who you want as each parties Leader Candidate or who you don't want! I want to know if you would attend a U.S. type of debate at the Kings Hall?
If we applied the pressure on to our local politicians they would not be able to get out of such an event! Can we make this happen?
55 comments:
Sounds interesting...
A selection of questions posed to representatives of each of the parties who have to to answer in front of an audience..
Sign me up, I'll gladly get involved in organising this..
Could anyone from the Independents tell us why they have had a history of putting forward such poor candidates, and what they are doing to improve things?
Here are some of the most notorious Independent councillors who have been elected:
Jenny Holdcroft - created racial unrest in Burslem and Cobridge through her 'campaigns'.
Ted Owen - has now been in more parties than most people have had hot dinners.
Dave Chatton - was able to show the invisible man a thing or two on how not to get seen and was then done for drink driving.
Barry Cuthbertson - the only councillor in Stoke-on-Trent to have defected to the BNP so far.
John Lamingman - banned from holding public office for 5 years for sexually harassing a council officer. Arrested at Port Vale and a takeaway in Burslem for public order offences.
And the best - Lee Wanger. On the sex offenders register for 5 years for child porn.
Any comments from the Independents would be welcome.
Tony I think this is a really great idea, I would certainly want to attend such an event if possible.
I still do not understand what the different parties stand for and would really like to hear that from them, what it means locally. We can all go away and look at national web sites but it doesn't seem specific enough to allow us to know what they are likely to do to us, or for us.
The problem I find is particularly bad with the labour, tory and libdem lot on the council because they largely just do not communicate that much and on the odd occasions when they do it's pretty uninspiring. What you would need to do when you are being the anti-bambi/super-paxman, is not let them get away with talking waffle about facing challenges and moving stuff forwards and making step changes and all the other stuff that means b***r all. They need to talk about real issues.
One thing I think with the leader system for the council is that if it is done well, it's not got to be a dictatorship like the mayor. So if it is set up so that ward councillors have a proper input, then maybe it will matter more to people whether to vote and how to vote, if they see that it can make a difference. I think apathy now is because people figure it won't matter one iota. The council leader I reckon needs to be the one who is best at taking input from all other councillors and making the system work.
Now I just have to say something about Ibbs, IF you manage to pin him down in that forum, I can almost guarantee that what he will tell people is to shut up, he's done it before more than once, he'll be thoroughly horrible. I don't imagine he wants to do anything at all for the people of Trentham he has so badly let down. And Irving wouldn't either unless Ibbs let him. I don't think there is any hope for the tories unless they get shot of Ibbs and that other one who people rightly don't like for his tendencies. So I'd like to hear from the tories when they are getting rid of Ibbs and what they would be like after. I'd like to hear from labour what they'd be like after Meredith and whether they are willing to start now. And I'd like to hear from the others more about what they'd be like.
Tag Fan, looks like you have made a list of the 'greatest misses' for the Independents!
Tony, why don't we just do it? It's no big deal is it? I am sure with our contacts and organisational skills we can make this happen. And I am sure we could get the use of the Kings Hall for such an important community event.
Any councillors who choose not to take part will be sending a clear message to the electorate - "I want the leadership but I really don't want to do much for it".
I think we should go for it - not sure what the actual timescale is for the Leadership vote, but I am sure we could get this arranged.
I like the idea of you chairing it - Jeremy Paxman/Bambi - I've never seen you do either yet,so it should be interesting!!
Seriously though, I am sure there are a lot of bloggers interested in this (such as Sir F who has already volunteered), and who would be willing to help us... And what a great way to re-engage the people of the city in local politics!
Just don't drag me and Craig's love affair into this forum, it's getting tedious. What two grown men do in their own homo is entirely up to them.
This is what we were talking about prior to that poor excuse for a referendum. It is a good idea!
Get the candidates to take turns, but try and balance the questions a little fairer eh Tony? This is your city, make them outline what they will do for it.
Lets hope none of them on your list ... what hope for Stoke with any of them on your list in charge.
Your list is full of clowns, jokers and fools ... better off with the town hall cat in charge than any of them lot!
I agree with Nicky, what a fantastic idea. I fear though that its a bit optimisitc to think that the electorate might have any sort of say-certainly us lowly party members will have none!
Have a look at Staffordshire County Council's 'Councillor Question Time' on their website, that might be a good model for you to suggest to the Council, a bit more meaningful than Public Question Time in current Council meetings too.
I fear that the result of the referendum will mean that such a debate will never happen. The Leader of the Council is not accountable to the people of the city, just his ward constituents and the Council. This will all be sorted out behind closed doors before the Annual Council meeting in May. After the chaos of the last few years and the need for a new start you might find that members are less enthusiastic about washing their dirty linen in public than they were when Mayor-bashing, be it Wolfey, Mark Meredith or Paul Breeze when he was Wolfey's deputy.
Enough of my cynicism though, let's not reinvent the wheel unnecessarily, there will be good ideas at other Councils which we can learn from. This debate is needed if we are to renew our local politics!
Great positivity so far, you're right Ali, we should just get on and do it! Sir Findo is up for it and i'm sure we could talk Nicky and a few others into helping organising the debate. We have to inject some enthusiasm into politics on a local level, we have to find some way of engaging the population and to say get involved. Who else wants to get involved in the orgsanisation of th event?
I just noticed that Peter Kent-Baggaley of the Potteries Alliance has been missed from the list of possible candidates for Council Leader.
Incidentally I understand that the Potteries Alliance are planning a re-launch to try to present themselves differently, details here:
http://img300.imageshack.us/my.php?image=palq8.jpg
No such thing as society,
Ho, ho, ho, that Bob Bagley did actually start a contagious obsession with phone boxes... (it was Bob that started it I think).
I'd like PKB at this event, I've heard him speak before and he's good to listen to - I know others won't agree but there you go, we have to have a good selection of people.
Firstly, it should be recognised that only a couple of political party members have taken the time to be involved with this blog and to help the public debate go forward.
Second, it should be pointed out why National Politics (and our parties) appear to be very distant from what goes on locally.
Shaun Bennet will always campaign and support the Tory candidate, even with gritted teeth.That's how it is. The same goes for me as a Labour member.
When I hear that Alby will make a great leader because he was polite once and plays bingo with old ladies, I cry.
I know where he's coming from and I also know where Shaun is comiong from.They know where I come from also.
For some reason, this is interpreted as not being particularly helpful for the people of Stoke.
That is of course, utter bollocks.
National Parties are the structural backbone of the local party, whichever the party and credit must be given to the independents for fooling the public into believing the opposite and to convincing voters that a link of National incompetence equals local incompetence. Again, bollocks.
My party stands for family tax credits and winter fuel allowances for the elderly (no link locally?) and Shaun's Party detests these ideas and will remove them (black holes in the economy and all that).
Alby's party is racist (their National leaders know me personally).
So, whether you like it or not, National Party politics does have a significant bearing on what goes on locally.
Please do not be fooled or misled by those who want to promote the independent view as being superior to mine.
You know where I'm coming from but you haven't a clue where the independent comes from.
One thing that links all of us together, the racist, the socialist and the capitalist, is that we are all NICE.
So let's ignore manners and politeness and hone solely into POLICIES!
That is how we decide who is right and who is wrong and who will do most for Stoke-on-Trent.
The real objection to Kent Baggaley becoming leader of the council should not be about him being in a party small enough to fit into a phone box, it should be because he is a sodding Stalinist!!!
I know where you come from.
You were hatched from an egg that came from outerspace!!
Never in all my life have I read so much crap! All this, "I know where they are coming from, and they know where I'm coming from."
Just one big pile of Elsby manure!
You don't seem to be capable of understanding just how politically savvy, we as a party are. And I hope you and these others continue to write us off as unimportant,
a minor irritation, because it's under the cover of your overgrown
conceit that we will steal yet another march on the local parties that keep telling us how good they are, but keep failing to show us how good they are!
You seem to be operating under the misconception that you are some kind of local mover and shaker. I'm sorry to disappoint you, but you are of no importance at all, even the Labour members in council were calling you for everything. You can criticise and attack Alby Walker as much as you like, but the man has beaten you 3 times on the turn in your chosen
constituency, there are three BNP councillors in that ward, and you should gather from that, that things are changing, and these are
fundamental changes in the voting patterns not just here in Stoke-on-Trent, but right acros the country.
Your refusal to accept that these changes even exist will undoubtedly
speed up the demise of your party,
and hopefully that will be a permanent conclusion to your ignorance and blindness.
The real problem lies with all three main parties. It's all well and good for Shaun to extol the
positives of the Tory party, but what are they? If Gary Elsby is right, and national parties shape
local parties, then the LibLabCon
should by rights be dead in the water, because both Labour and Tory have refused to take us out of the EU, or reduce immigration, whereas the ridiculous and dying LibDems actually want to take us deeper into europe and increase immigration! The only party who will guarantee our withdrawal from the EU is the BNP. The only party that will stop immigration, and the reverse the trend, is the BNP.
The ONLY party that would put the
native people first is the BNP, and if for one second you think that policy won't count for much, you'd better look again. Britain is heading faster and faster toward the vortex created by 40 years or more of mismanagement and deceit by Labour and Tory governments. If that is the standard of your national governance, why would the standards of your local governance be any better? And with finances becoming ever tighter as recession
descends upon our economy, the real British people will expect to be protected as much as possible from the effects of it by the government that is supposed to be there to oversee the interests of the British people are the number one priority. When that doesn't happen, watch our share of the vote rise. When the Tories take the next general election, and fail to fix the problems because of their obstinate refusal to leave behind the shackles of this
global racketeering, watch again as our vote share increases. It is the inability of the three main parties to change direction from the path down which we've travelled for the past 50 years, that will lead to their eventual passing, the quicker the better.
Honestly Nicky it wasn't me that started off the phone box thing with Kent Bagaley, it was a friend who pointed it out and I though it was funny given his campaign to save the old style BT phone boxes from being scrapped.
But I do agree with anonymous above that the real concern with Mr. Kent Bagaley ever leading the council should be over his extreme left wing ideas summed up by his attitude that he would rather the city forfeit the BSF money than accept the building of any academies. Not a very responsible position to take.
Bob, I think you miss PKB's point.
Forfeit the money if the only role is to accept Academies?
This Government will not build new schools in Stoke, when its manifesto is to build them?
Where does Academies come into the equation? Proof please.
This doesn't mean I accept PKB's view, it means I see his point.
US Style campaigning in the moribund world of British politics? What a good idea. How about primaries for candidates in local elections?
The idea of all the candidates for council leader taking part in a broadcast debate sounds good, it would certainly sort the wheat from the chaff.
About the only thing from US politics we don't need is the negative campaigning regarding candidates private lives, ie the Swift Boat scandal of 2004 or the attempts to smear Obama this time round bceause of some of the thing people he went to college with might have said and done.
This is an excellent Idea,lets dispel the myths and lies aimed at all party's, and let them put forward their view of how to move this city forward.
One party member from each of the party's to answer Questions from the public in the King,s Hall.
With a strong unbiased presenter, and a minimum time limit of two hours.
Lets set it up ASAP, before the set up of the leader and cabinet,
Adam,
Its the primarys I can't agree to.
Look at the problems we have now with party members washing our linen in public.
In the primarys, you have reps from the same party publicly washing rinsing and hanging out to dry theirs linens...
How is that helpful ?
And the millions of dollars they waste on these debates......
Craig my mate! Tell me why ir is that your party have been a success in Abbey Hulton when as far as i know there are no Asian families and very few black families? I was born in Abbey Hulton, my dad still lives there, I know the area, you never know Craig i may stand as a councillor there next time around, would your lot soundly beat me? You say you are close to National dominance, how so? With a hand full of councillors around the country and not a single MP, yeh Craig looks like you lot have cracked it dude! You see the fear for most people is that you lot say you are not racist but we don't really want to take the chance, do we? Look at your parties history, it isn't really credible is it?
Tell me how many members your party has totally? I heard 5000? That isn't really going to speed you to victory is it?
When you've answered that lot are you going to volunteer yourself to help organise our public debate?
Tony, I've told you a million times, stop exaggerating!
Why would you expect to find black and asian families in a white working class area like Abbey? Is there some law that says
we now have to have immigrants in every one of our communities just to make the liberals feel better?
Honesty is the best policy, and the honesty in this case is stating that there are too many
foreigners in this city as it is,
without finding space for anymore!
You can stand as councillor if you wish, just remember that other lefty Elsby, has had no luck at all there.
Where the hell you get this next piece of cobblers from, I do not know! Nowhere in my posting does it say anything at all about our national dominance. You have to stop making these exaggerations Tony, anyone would think you were going to run for council.
If you did, what would you run as?
Labour, independent? It would be deeply dishonest of you to run as anything but Labour, seeing as that is what you are.
Once again you mention the ridiculous figure of 5000 when talking of our membership. The last time I checked we were at slightly over 12,000, but in an election, it's the number of votes that count, not the number of members. We're heading toward victory at just the right pace thank you very much.
I'll do what I can to help you
arrange this debate, just let me know what you want.
Craig, I think you know what Tony mean't when he asked why many people in Abbey Hulton turn to the BNP when it is one of, if not the whitest places around.
Tony wasn't implying that he wanted the area "enriched" (thats the PC term you folks use).
I don't know who I would stand Craig, honestly! I was until recently a Labour Party member but resigned because i feel that the party is without direction locally. I do know one thing I think I could poll some votes there I have lots of friends and come from one of the biggest families in the Abbey. Maybe i'll stand on a single issue like how there can be an effective councillor without having some extreme views. Do you think that could work? There are some lovely, decent, and community minded people in the Abbey and I think I could be the one to break the BNP stronghold.
Tony, you may have to stand as an independent...
What a good idea, with the council takeing control of the city again, we need to 'run the tape' over the leadership contenders and what better way to do it.
Its brill, just so long as Terry and Craig dont turn up in there black PVC get ups.
It is the democratic right of every one of us to stand for public service, but you have to remember that one mans extremism,
is another mans commonsense. Like I keep trying to get through to you, this isn't about being anti
immigrant but pro British. Big family or not Tony, you will have your work cut out, but feel free to do what you feel you must.
Did someone mention me? There's so many of me these days I can't quite remember which one I am. The image of 20 T Copes in PVC sounds quite scary really. I might even be the real T Cope who's joined in this bandwagon. One thing's for sure there are quite a number of people now pretending to be me, not just one. The whole thing's snowballing out of control.
That should differentiate me from the other T Copes. I can now debate on here in peace without being hijacked by a bunch of tossers who seriously need to get a life pretending that I'm in a gay relationship with half the local party membership.
Look, I'm the real Terry Cope, will you all stop it. Imitation is the highest form of flattery.
Craig, again dishes the dirt on me.
As the failing candidate in the Abbey (a massive year on year increase in my vote as others went into freefall)I can give an insight into what goes on.
First, it was my fault in failing. I missed one trick that would have secured my win and hopefully this will be my only trick if or when I face Alby Walker. I will take bets now that I will beat him.
During my campaign in the Abbey, I came across the local die hard Nazi BNP big mouth supporter (businessman) ripping me off publicly. I loved this.
He blatantly went about shouting the odds of how wonderful all things Alby was and all these 'niggers and Paki's should be fucked off!'
I asked him of asylum seekers, the champion cry of the BNP. He told me and the crowd, now gathered, that they are 'everywhere'.
I enquired, where?
EVERYWERE, he shouted (very loudly).
Where, exactly?, I asked very politely.
Are you thick, Gary?
Maybe, just tell me where.
'Duck, tell this thicko where they all are!(I think he meant me).
Everywhere, she said, with a look that could kill.
Deep breath,where? take me to one, just one that's all.I said.
You're too fucking thick to understand, Gary, they are everywhere all over the Abbey!They get all the houses first and we get none!
There aren't any and you're making it up, I said, and you couldn't take me to one if you tried.
You won't get a fucking vote here in the Abbey and Alby will piss all over you!
His wife (actually) Ellie beat me on that occassion after two recounts. I will not go into the 'missing 100 votes' that won it for me and I remain defeated.
There are no asylum seekers in the Abbey and as far as I know, no Pakistani's (not that I give a damn if there are) and maybe black people do live there. Good for them.
I absolutely guarantee that I will crush Alby Walker, if given the chance.
Gary
Everyone knows Abbey's a whites only part of the city just as much as they know they're mainly anti-social shite and dole scroungers. Why bother with the area Gary? If they want to believe the BNP bollocks let them. Then maybe when companies start thinking twice about jobs in the city they'll wake up.
You know it would make sense for the cranks and crackpots (BNP, Independents and Potteries Alliance) to all get together in one group so we don't get confused between them.
Taking the best from each, how about the British Potteries Independent Group (or British PIG for short)?
You can't mention pig, that is a racist remark against the muslims.
" brooneyes said...
You can't mention pig, that is a racist remark against the muslims.
31 October 2008 13:19"
Craig,
Please explain this remark.
I always thought that being a Muslim meant a person following that religion ?
I could be wrong, of course, because Christians must be white - if we follow that logic, and yet I seem to remember a book informing me that 2008 years ago, a child was born to a very non white young couple, and he grew up to preach to all of the area we roughly know as Isreal, and of course those pesky immigrant Romans (Italians and their conquered nations).
He said something about treating others as we would expect to be treated, not upsetting your neighbour... any of this remotely familiar ??
You are indigenous to England, aren't you ??
St George, it was a flippant remark, not meant to be taken as some kind of accurate comment on
multiculturalism. Get a life dude.
Gary, the example I gave about Mr. Peter K-B was only meant to be a general one.
The fact is that while you are clearly a mainstream Labour supporter this man is some kind of Darwinian throwback to a time when your party was more interested in following self imposed extremist political ideology than winning elections and being able to do things to help ordinary people. His time as deputy leader of your party clearly brought into focus his Stalinist dictatorial behaviour. No wonder he didn't last very long after the Labour party told him enough was enough.
Craig
I am no so sure this was just a flippant remark.
The BNP machine always mixes this up.
They must be brain washing you ??
Craig, please, get a grip, stop talking so much shit, you should get a career in comedy. The word pig racist towards muslims? The only people I thought it was racist towards was coppers.
No Martin, and the only one talking shite round here is you.
St George, I just told you it was a flippant remark. I know the difference between being racist and religionist as you will gather if you have read my posts. If it wasn't flippant, I wouldn't have said it was.
Fancy a bit later Craig?
I was born in the Abbey,also from a large family, and the split in political following is no different than anywhere else.
To accuse the people of that area of anything else is a total fabrication, and an insult to the people who live their.
I believe that the reason why there is not a mix of races is because the main areas of mixed races is close to the town centres, where mono cultures have formed themselves into mono communities.
Gary Elsby these comments you made, can you substantiate your remarks, or is this a fantasy?
Maybe black people live in the Abbey? don't you know?
May I suggest that people read Terry Turbo's blog which can be accessed through his profile. Just click on his name, ok!
Bob Bagley you need to cool down. Theres no need to get wound up about Kent Baggaley, he will never become leader of the council and is ridiculed by other councillors for his delusions of grandeur when only working from a phone box!
Approach the Council and see if they want to do something like this?
http://www.staffordshire.gov.uk/yourcouncil/questiontime/
The recent White Paper, Communities in Control, suggests that the Government will legislate to ensure that Councils have a statutory 'duty to promote democracy'. This is the kind of thing that would help a lot.
A number of points.
First, to Bob Baguley who denounces PKB with passion.
Peter was asked to come into the Labour Party at short notice to fight an election for us in an area heading towards the BNP. He didn't have enough service in to fulfil the rules but those same rules do allow special circumstances. PKB fought and won the seat for us.
The reason he, Salhi and Booth were susspended (6 months) was because of a vote breach. (Leader, Deputy and Chief whip. Wow!).They formed an oppsosition during the suspension and this clearly broke the rules. With all the will in the world, no one could save them.
The argument lies in whether they were wrong in the very first place and a poll of all Labour members would suggest that they were not and should never have been put into that position.
That was my view to the recent Labour NEC visit to this City, recently which gave a full account of the situation on the ground.
My party will always support whoever the group itself chooses as leader(for them, remember)and so it would be wildly unfair of me to suggest we all support PKB as leader of the Council (as told to me by many many many 'friends').PKB is neither a lunatic, a Communist or a anything other than a clever socially minded person.Good luck to him.
Tony Turbo makes the point that not everyone in the Abbey is a racist. He's right. A significant part of my vote came from there. He also asks for proof of my encounter with the Nazi shouting the odds.
Sorry, Mr. Turbo, my name is Gary Elsby and therefore your request is rather pointless. Just accept what I say as being the truth as told by me.
To the former Town Clerk. Once again you promote Democracy via a quango. I support Democracy ONLY by elected people, whether they are Republicans,former terrorists, ex jailbirds (Mandella+Adams)Labour and even, if I have to, Conservatives.The BNP have a legitimate right to promote division and racism.
I do not and never will accept a 'transition board'.
Stoke-on-Trent has just given its Democracy back to the voters with no second preference votes required.
Single member wards, changed boundaries, higher paid councillors,Billionaires becoming councillors, who cares? That's life.
Elected people have done the business and unelected people have the chance to either put up, shut up don't put up and shout loudly.
Just like everywhere else in this Country. So why Stoke for the quango? It is the Government that got it wrong, not the people of Stoke.
Get rid of this Transition Board.
Gary, spouting ineligible claptrap again, I see.
Comments like these do not help Gary, Kent Baggaley does not deserve to be given any credibility at all.
As I said earlier Kent Baggaley will never become leader of the council and is ridiculed by other councillors for his delusions of grandeur.
What's this, "no such thing as society", no reference to phoneboxes.
Your slipping!
Gary - The marxist/stalinist views of Peter Kent-Baguley are widely known amongst councillors and officers. If you are in any doubt just speak to Reg Booth, he now regrets ever having become involved with the man after where it's got him. Admittedly Kent-Baguley can do a good job of hiding his views to certain people such as one time Potteries Alliance councillor Ted Owen who has right wing leanings and in the past has used material copied from the BNP in his literature.
I've been around too long to be fooled even more than I already have been and so I reject the nonsense of PKB being a lesser councillor than most.
I was there in May as PKB made his leader speech to the assembled at the voting count.
He flattened all comers with an honesty that Roger Ibbs doesn't have.
Mike Tappin and the rest were voted out, just like we said they would be.
I may not be helpful to the Labour cause by pointing these things out, but hey, that's what honesty does for you.
Peter isn't my hero, he is just an honest man with a reputation that precedes him.
I admire that.
Mr Elsby was this left wing speech you heard when you had lost the election to us again?
I am not bothered about sodding Peter Bent Bagguley. Craig is coming to get him!!!
Gary,
Where have I advocated democracy by quango here? I have advocated the public holding the council/councillors to account in a public meeting. I've not mentioned the Transition Board on this thread. Please accept my apologies if I have confused you. You're entitled to your views on the TB, just as I am - that, my friend, is one of the pillars of a democracy.
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